Jodie Ounsley & Michael Hooper Give Back Through HSBC World of Opportunity Programme – We Talk Career Transitions, Life Experiences and Asking For Help
Both Jodie Ounsley, an England 7s player and Gladiator who now works in the media, as well as recently retired Wallabies legend Michael Hooper, were engaging with young fans as part of the HSBC World of Opportunity Programme at The Sevens Stadium this past weekend at the Emirates Dubai 7s.
We spoke with both about the next chapters of their careers, stepping into the media limelight, and advice they would give aspiring media professionals as well as players retiring from the sport.
The HSBC World of Opportunity Programme took place in Dubai for the fourth time and forms part of HSBC’s commitment to empowering young people in the sports industry. Alongside other HSBC brand ambassadors, Bryna Habana and Abby Gustaitis, the team provided young people with experience and mentorship as part of the goal of connecting them with athletes, social media experts, PR professionals, and event planners.
Jodie, who has been championing accessibility in sports as she has a cochlear implant, has spoken publicly about breaking down barriers and advocating for deaf athletes – and she interacted with the group in Dubai about how to handle quick-fire interviews, and dealing with the unexpected.
Hooper, who hung up his boots after failing to make the Australia Men’s Sevens squad for the Paris 2024 Olympics following an injury, spoke about his career to date and how he’s got into media and commentating – as well as teaching the students about how to battle nerves.
He said, “I had this moment when I was on set and the screen for the cameras was in front of me and the guys were counting down 5-4-3-2, and everything I wanted to say, I forgot. I just thought I was gonna make a complete fool of myself. Jody talked about putting yourself out there and getting uncomfortable. I look back on that and I’m really proud that I gave it a crack and tried something new.
Hooper explained: “You just have to get that first one underway, and then you work on things that you can improve, and you get more comfortable. It’s like anything you learn, you get better, you refine your skill, and you enjoy it. I think that’s the thing with perceptions and what your perception is. My perception of the media was a bad thing as a player but I have changed that perception when you yourself become a storyteller.”
Rugby Origins And The Sport’s Evolution
Ounsley explained how she first got involved in rugby and why she decided to give it a try.
“For me, it was my younger brother. I was involved in a lot of different sports growing up, mainly athletics and Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu. When I was 15, I went to watch my brother train and play and I absolutely loved it. I thought, ‘I want to give that a go’.
I did not think I’d be able to play rugby because I have a cochlear implant and thought you’re not allowed to do contact sports. But we found a way around that, and after I did my first session, I was just hooked. I loved how people were just smashing each other and tackling. I am quite a contact-driven person, and that team side of it – I like the part of rugby.”
Michael Hooper also got into rugby through his family. He explained how his dad is English and made the move to Australia.
“My dad asked himself – well, how do you get to know people? You join the rugby club. So he joined the Manly Marlins, who he played for, for many years and he became an Australian citizen. My brother played at Manly and I played a couple of games but not as many as my brother. He played 97 times which really breaks my old man because he could get three more and then get 100 caps. But that was my introduction to rugby – where I grew up, in a really strong rugby union area, and I grew up with the Wallabies as one of the best teams in the world, or the best team in the world, and I wanted to be a part of that.”
We asked both what the biggest changes were that they had seen in rugby over the years.
Jodie explained, “I think it’s been quite drastic even in the space I’ve been in this over the last eight years. In terms of the exposure, contracts, and opportunities coming from outside of rugby, like brands, and sponsorships. I think that how people perceive women’s rugby as well has changed a lot. So that’s been quite refreshing. There’s a long way to go, but it’s an exciting time for young girls.”
Hooper added that one of the ongoing changes is the constant rugby law changes. “One of the good things about rugby is trying to keep the game fresh and new and modern and attractive for the fans to watch, but then it’s also quite confusing for the fans and the players as well.
On the professional side, when I started, it was professional, but I finished school and went straight down to the ACT Brumbies in 2009. It didn’t feel as professional as it is now. The travel schedule wasn’t as drastic – you would be “touring” more like what we’re doing a bit here this weekend – enjoying some of the things more off the field than perhaps you do these days. One of the hardest travels we did was going to Sydney, and then to South Africa. You’d play maybe down in Cape Town, and then you go the week after and you’d play in Argentina, and then you’d go back home and play another game at home. So you’d go around the world within two weeks – that’s three different time zones.
It’s one of the wonderful things about rugby, but it’s also quite draining on family and friends as well.”
HSBC World of Opportunity Programme
Jodie was at the recent Paralympics in Paris and stepped into the media spotlight as a host and we asked what she had been involved in with the World of Opportunity Programme in Dubai.
“I think obviously when you’re a rugby player, your whole life and focus and energy are put into that, and then you kind of don’t really think about what’s going to happen after playing. So it can be daunting and quite scary, especially for young kids who maybe are not athletes, but want to know what jobs are available within sport.
That’s what the program is all about. We had workshops and people speaking and sharing experiences from playing on the fields and working in the media to give these kids an idea and an experience of what they could go into. And it’s been really nice because the kids have been really engaged.”
Ounsley added, “I think it tested me as well, because even doing these programs, we have to share our experiences, but we still don’t have it all figured out. So it was quite nice to have those honest conversations with the kids about what I’ve learned, but also just let them know it’s not going to be easy – there are challenges and it’s just how you navigate that.”
Hooper expanded on this, “I think no one person is an island. And what I mean by that is there’s a huge network that rugby provides, and there’s a huge network being involved with HSBC and the Sevens community can provide as well.
What’s great about the World of Opportunity is it’s teaching kids that they don’t have to have it all figured out, like everyone does not have it all figured out, but they can ask for help. They can reach out to that network. They can get in touch with other people who may be able to steer them in a direction that can put them into something they may like or dislike but at least actions are being taken.”
He added, “So you don’t have to sit there and try and think, Okay, what am I going to do? How am I going to do it? Reach out to other people, and utilize that network.
As Jody said, we don’t have all the secrets or have all the answers but we can share experiences. One of the great things is to pass that down to people who may or may not use it, and they can then create their own path and hopefully do the same.”
Did They Choose a Media Pathway? How HSBC World of Opportunity Is Opening Doors
Jodie explained that she had always lacked confidence growing up. “If you said, even two years ago, that I would be doing the things I am now, I would have never imagined that. But it’s kind of come about just from me trying things, even if I really didn’t want to do it all but I gave it a go anyway. It just opened doors and different opportunities along the way. So I still do that now, I kind of just scare myself a little bit to do things, and then afterwards, I’m happy I’ve done that.”
Hooper said bluntly. “I detested the media a lot of the time when I was playing. They’re quick to jump on you when things are going tough, and they’re a necessary part of the game, but you get involved in sport to play it and to be competing on the field. But you get to connect with the media and it is so important because you’re connecting to the fans and the people that support and fund and enjoy the game and pack out stadiums like we’re seeing here this weekend.
I was hoping to be at the 2023 World Cup, and I didn’t get that opportunity. So then a hole opened up in the broadcast space and I thought ‘Well, I still want to be connected in some way.’
When you get to work on the broadcasting side, you can shine the light on these players and say how good they are, and hear great stories and different pathways that are taken, and you become much more of a fan because you’re hearing the stories of different people. That’s what’s really nice now, being on the other side.
What Advice Would They Give To Retiring Players?
Jodie said candidly, “I probably would say it is going to be scary and nerve-wracking, but I think it’s just about embracing it and probably just trying things that you might enjoy outside of rugby. It’s hard doing that because rugby is literally all you care about your whole life. But then it’s just trying to find things outside of that that can make it a bit easier when you do transition.
You’re never gonna have it figured out and I think it’s just kind of taking risks, taking chances, saying yes to things. You might hate it, but you might absolutely love it. So I think it’s just the whole point of trying stuff.”
The retired Wallaby agreed.
Hooper said, “It’s about taking action and doing something. And I think sometimes you can get paralyzed a little bit when there’s plenty of opportunity out there. It is important to ask for help and see what other players have done. There are a lot of players and athletes that have transitioned throughout their careers.
In reality, everyone has a transition in life. You finish school, you finish University, you change jobs, you become a father or a mother or something like that. So there are a lot of different similarities, but sometimes as athletes, you have that transition – so it feels like you’re behind the eight ball a bit, and that’s not the case.”
Use Your Support Networks
Ounsley has spoken publicly about how important her family has been in her life and career. She elaborated, “I was going to say that just leaning on the people around you is important because you can’t do it on your own. I did lean on my family. I didn’t at first, because I just kind of kept it to myself and I thought, “Oh, I need to know what I’m doing”.
But then when I did speak to my heart, I should have done that all along. So for someone else, it might not be family, it might be a friend, or teammates as well. My teammates were brilliant because they were like family. It sounds cliche, but they were the people I trust because you go through a lot together.”
You can follow more of the HSBC World of Opportunity here.
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